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Authorities have arrested three Tijuana teenagers for allegedly killing a man who refused to pay a prostitute for services, the Baja California attorney general said in a statement issued on Tuesday, October 6.

Sulivan Ibarra Villanueva, 18, his sister, Estefanía Ibarra Villanueva, 19, and a friend, Sarahí Vanessa Zamora Loera, also 18, are being held at the state prison in Tijuana. Each teen faces up to 50 years behind bars if convicted in the September 24 killing of Rafael Domínguez Flores, 55.

According to the attorney general’s statement, Domínguez met Estefanía Ibarra in late May at a downtown Tijuana restaurant and offered the young woman 800 pesos (about $60) to go to a hotel on Boulevard Insurgentes for sex. Afterward, the two went to an automatic teller machine where Domínguez said he would withdraw the money, but in the meantime asked the young woman to go to a nearby store to buy some sodas.

While Ibarra was inside the store, Domínguez took off. Two days later, the young woman was able to track down her customer where he was working at a construction site. When she asked for her money, Domínguez told her he would pay her the next time he saw her.

On September 24, Domínguez was allegedly lured to an apartment where the two accused women lived — and where Sulivan Ibarra was lying in wait, according to the attorney general’s statement. As soon as he entered the apartment, Domínguez was attacked from behind and strangled to death with an electric cable. His body was dumped on the side of a dirt road in a remote area of the city.

The attorney general said Estefanía Ibarra took all the money Domínguez had in his possession at the time of his death. Her brother allegedly sold the victim’s Ford F-150 pickup and used the money to pay medical expenses for his wife’s childbirth.

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rickeysays Oct. 8, 2009 @ 12:24 a.m.

If you force a prostitute to have sex and then don't pay, is it rape or shoplifting?

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Josh Board Oct. 8, 2009 @ 12:54 a.m.

That sounds so Bill Hicks, rickey. Funny.

I have to assume (and Pete, don't get any ideas), if you don't pay a prostitute, she wouldn't have any recourse, as you were involved in an illegal activity. So, let's just assume the cops are called. And the woman explained the situation to the cop. The guy could say "Gee officer, I thought she was kidding about that whole money thing." And what does he do at that point?

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David Dodd Oct. 8, 2009 @ 1 a.m.

Okay, there are a number of things wrong with this story.

And Bob, before you get your panties in a bunch, I'm sure that you ganked it from La Frontera, so before you go off on me, I'm not exactly blaming you. But you might learn something from this, so pay attention.

First, let's talk about sixty dollars. Sorry. The only johns that pay sixty dollars for a [insert appropriate carnal event here] are tourists. That price is far too high. Especially out in my neck of the woods, which happens to be within a couple of miles of where this happened (allegedly).

Twenty to thirty dollars, maximum, is the going rate. No, I don't sleep with hookers. But yes, I know.

Secondly, no Tijuana hooker does ANYTHING without having that money in her pocket first. Not one of them. They all know better that that.

Here's the kicker: Who paid for the hotel room? If dead homeboy couldn't pay for the hooker (and NO WAY did SHE pay for the room), then how did they wind up at an ATM machine AFTERWARD?

And, oh yeah, this happened in May? MAY!? And they've reached this conclusion in October?

Just food for thought. And, there is MUCH more behind this story than what's being reported. Much more. And Bob, stop taking offense if I comment on your stringer stories. Feedback is what makes you a better reporter. And I strongly suggest that you get out and interview or investigate some of these things and not simply rely on a Mexican newspaper. With caution, of course, but stick your nose into these things. Don't take their word for anything.

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PistolPete Oct. 8, 2009 @ 9:25 a.m.

Doh!!! Bob got busted and called on it!

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nan shartel Oct. 8, 2009 @ 10:13 a.m.

Gringo!!!

alrighty then!!!

do you have time to do those south of the border stories..u should man..that was awesome!!

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Bob McPhail Oct. 8, 2009 @ 10:20 a.m.

Refried -- Nope, didn't refry a Frontera story. The information in the story came from a press release issued by the Baja California Attorney General's office, and that attribution appears repeatedly in the story so the reader knows who is alleging the information. If the source had been Frontera (or El Mexicano, or El Sol, etc.) I would have noted it. So at least you can trust me on attribution. As far as the factual accuracy of what the attorney general said, I can't vouch for that -- which is the purpose of attribution. Read any newspaper in the US, especially crime reports, and you almost always see the same thing ("police said," "authorities said," "the DA said in a statement," etc.) I agree with you, though, that there must be something more to the story. My big question was why the fellow who allegedly failed to pay the alleged prostitute would, months later after she allegedly tried to collect on the debt, voluntarily go to her apartment. Does not make sense to me and suggests there was a more complicated relationship among those involved. I am reminded of a famous quote from Ben Bradlee, onetime editor at the Washington Post in an interview on 60 Minutes that went something like this: "Newspapers print what people tell them. People lie. So, yes, newspapers print lies." And, from bitter personal experience years ago involving a close friend -- a Mexican citizen -- I know, too, that the 'ministerial police' (formerly called state judicial police) extract false confessions using what amounts to torture and put a lot of innocents in prison. So I have no opinion on the guilt or innocence of these three youngsters and I pity them for the fate that awaits them, whether guilty or innocent of the alleged crime.

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SurfPuppy619 Oct. 8, 2009 @ 11:30 a.m.

If you force a prostitute to have sex and then don't pay, is it rape or shoplifting?

By rickeysays

He did not "force" her top have sex, she did it willingly.

So the crime is theft by fraud.

Unless the sex was bad-then he would have had a breach of contract defense.

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Josh Board Oct. 8, 2009 @ 11:54 a.m.

That's funny, surf. But, to keep the funny going, and serious stuff aside...

What if a john is talking to a prostitute. They agree to have sex for money. But after 45 minutes, the prostitute is wondering why it's not over yet. Can you renegotiate the price?

There are so many questions about how this transaction works, I'd love to hear all the fine print that nobody ever reads!

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David Dodd Oct. 8, 2009 @ 12:51 p.m.

Bob, fair enough. I know how "interrogations" go here, I mean, it could be a simple matter of the suspects telling the cops what the cops wanted to hear. The funny thing about Mexico is that generally, the bad guys go to jail. It's a weird path to justice, but it seems to be successful enough most of the time.

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PistolPete Oct. 8, 2009 @ 12:58 p.m.

Is it me or do Mexicans view the sanctity of life a tad less then Americans?

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David Dodd Oct. 8, 2009 @ 1:16 p.m.

Well, Pete, Mexico does not employ the death penalty, and many States in the U.S. do. There are senseless murders on both sides. I don't see much of a difference to tell you the truth.

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SurfPuppy619 Oct. 8, 2009 @ 3:07 p.m.

What if a john is talking to a prostitute. They agree to have sex for money. But after 45 minutes, the prostitute is wondering why it's not over yet. Can you renegotiate the price?

By JoshBoard

The sex act would be limited to the length of time a "reasonable" man would need to finish. For most guys that would be [insert "reasonable" time here] minutes.

Since 45 minutes would exeed that reasonable time by a substantial amount then obviously the cost would have to reflect the extra time.

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SurfPuppy619 Oct. 8, 2009 @ 3:11 p.m.

There are senseless murders on both sides. I don't see much of a difference to tell you the truth.

By refriedgringo

The murder rate in TJ, and other drug hubs like Ciudad Juarez, are 10 times the rate of even our worst cities-such as LA, Chicago or Philly.

It is not even close.

Oh, and they don't allow firearms, so all the gun control nuts here in the USA better find a new tree to hug on.

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PistolPete Oct. 8, 2009 @ 3:12 p.m.

"Oh, and they don't allow firearms, so all the gun control nuts here in the USA better find a new tree to hug on."

AAAAAAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! That was f***in' beautiful!

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David Dodd Oct. 8, 2009 @ 3:40 p.m.

Surfpuppy, you're talking apples and oranges when it comes to a normal crime and a drug smuggling related crime. If you parsed out all murders directly related to cartels vs. cartels or authorities vs. cartels, it wouldn't be much different than in the U.S.

There are plenty of people on either side of the border that would kill each other over a piece of twenty billion dollars a year.

So far as guns go here, plenty of people have them, illegally, a fact that one becomes acutely aware of on New Year's Eve.

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SurfPuppy619 Oct. 8, 2009 @ 7:28 p.m.

"Oh, and they don't allow firearms, so all the gun control nuts here in the USA better find a new tree to hug on."

AAAAAAAAAAAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! That was f***in' beautiful!

By PistolPete

I went to grad school in Michigan and one of my best/favorite professors was always talking about the "California tree huggers".....LOL!

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whyigotahaveid Oct. 8, 2009 @ 8:38 p.m.

Pimpin Pimpin , as in any line of work. you should be paid for service rendered. i dont think she was a regular hooker. seems he found her attractive , probably tried to just pick her up . she declined he starts offering $$ $60.00 thats like a months salary no ? so she lets the sweaty pig do his business. he has buyers remorse and bales cuz obviously she isnt protected. then it takes her awhile to find him and she gives him time to pay again. and like the story sez , she didnt do it for a new purse. her family was in need of medical attention. and i bet she told sweaty pig of her plight and thats how it came to trade goods . you scratch my back , i scratch yours . the barter system

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SDaniels Oct. 8, 2009 @ 10:18 p.m.

'California tree huggers".....LOL!'

I'm waiting for Pete and Puppy to figure out how to develop a point--no, dont' mind me, I can check back in later :)

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antigeekess Oct. 8, 2009 @ 10:26 p.m.

"I'm waiting for Pete and Puppy to figure out how to develop a point--no, dont' mind me, I can check back in later :)"

My thought exactly. From gun control to "tree huggers?" My, someone likes that phrase a leeeetle too much. It was almost like a Tourette syndrome outburst.

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SDaniels Oct. 8, 2009 @ 11:29 p.m.

Whaddya know, someone made a point while I was gone! :)

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antigeekess Oct. 8, 2009 @ 11:48 p.m.

26:

That Tourette's guy is smokin' hot!

Thanks, Pete! ;)

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PistolPete Oct. 8, 2009 @ 11:56 p.m.

Didn't really notice but....what the hell!....lol

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SurfPuppy619 Oct. 9, 2009 @ 9:35 a.m.

That Tourette's guy is smokin' hot!

Thanks, Pete! ;)

By antigeekess

Yeah, I am sure you will be saying that after he chomps down on one of your body parts when an involuntary Tourette's episode pops up..............

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PistolPete Oct. 9, 2009 @ 10:14 a.m.

LOL! I didn't even think of that. That's pretty funny. AND f***ed up! :-D

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antigeekess Oct. 9, 2009 @ 4:30 p.m.

"I didn't even think of that."

I did. :)

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PistolPete Oct. 9, 2009 @ 4:34 p.m.

Nice! :-D Carpet anyone? O_o heh heh heh

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