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Whether or not you know the old bawdy song that begins with "Rolls In, Rolls In...." you will understand how the money belonging to residents of San Diego rolls OUT to retired city workers on pensions. I have just received a list of those getting pension money from the City. I have done some corroboration: how much is going to people who got in trouble in the pension scandal.

Consider the people who were charged in state and federal courts with violations of various laws. They got off. But they also got fat pensions. Among those getting off was Lawrence Grissom, who is getting $9,806.29 a month. Others who beat the rap: Loraine Chapin $9.799.68 a month, and Ronald Saathoff, a union head, $8,049.30. Patricia Frazier, whom Kroll Inc. said "acted with wrong intent": $14,238.56 a month. Former auditor Ed Ryan, also charged with acting with wrong intent: $10,416.73 a month. Former City Attorney Casey Gwinn, charged with negligence by Kroll: $8,155.95.

Others of note: Jack McGrory, former city manager, $7,766.26 a month. He left the City and joined the Price clan, climbing in the ranks. On May 31 of last year, he resigned as executive vice president and board member of PriceSmart. Former Police Chief Bill Kolender: $7,981.18 a month, plus whatever he gets as sheriff and also a state employee. Mayor Sanders, former police chief, $7,837.00. Bruce Herring, former deputy city manager who handled the Chargers giveaway: $13,538.52. The City picked up the tab for Herring on two probes into his role in bond disclosures.

The top 1,000 retirees are hauling in at least $5,487.88 a month. The top 500 are hauling in at least $6,593.90 a month.

KUSI-TV and former City Attorney Mike Aguirre expect to have more information tomorrow (Thurs., Aug. 26).


UPDATE 8/26/2010:

Click here to download the List of City of San Diego Retired Members through February 28, 2010 as a PDF

Click here to download the Annual Retirement Allowances Paid - City of San Diego - as a PDF

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Comments

SurfPuppy619 Aug. 26, 2010 @ 1:42 p.m.

Please keep us posted on this.............if posssible do we have the ages of the reitrees???

I mean we know Kolander is like 75, but many we do not know the ages of-especially those who are low profile......

I would like to see how many are in their 50's, 20+ years before the average mortality rate for both men and women.

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Don Bauder Aug. 26, 2010 @ 3:45 p.m.

Response to post #1: I don't have ages, but I have well over a thousand names and how much they receive monthly. I only posted some of the well-known former bureaucrats. There are lots more. Some are getting $12,000-$15,000 a month of retirement pay. That's a nice chunk. If only the City could afford to pay it. Best, Don Bauder

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SurfPuppy619 Aug. 26, 2010 @ 6:01 p.m.

. Some are getting $12,000-$15,000 a month of retirement pay. That's a nice chunk. If only the City could afford to pay it.

Well Don, thos pensions, it's not going to last. The money is not there. You saw the stats for the sales tax receipts, dropped thru the floor-they may be in China by the time this depression ends in who knows how long.

I will say this, Obama has been in office for close to 2 years, and it is not looking good for him. The bailouts are very upsetting to me and many others. They look like campaign pay backs, and do nothing but harm the country IMO.

Having the two yahoos Geitner and Bernanke claim the depression is over strains the Obama admin credibilty even more, to the point of losing their support-and vote. You can count me in that group pretty soon.

am giving Obama the entire 4 years to turn this mess around, but 4 years is plenty of time and if he fails I will vote for someone else (oh please God-don't let Palin win the republican ticket!!!)

We have never seen gov default in the history of this country, but zi predict we will within the next 5 years. It will be like dominos, once one falls, then a few more, then the tsunami.

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Founder Aug. 26, 2010 @ 7:54 p.m.

Reply #3 SP you are Right ON...

We are seeing the final "money grab" by our over paid Unions as they will now start to fight each other for what remains of the "crumbs" and in doing so all will go down together!

If they were smart they would oppose the tax increase and accept "voluntary" reductions in pay with the understanding that they might get a bonus in say 5 or 10 years of faithful service...

Please post the Money everyone is making over say $4,000 a month as that will make it crystal clear, as to just what our Leaders have done to the City's budget and to US, while treating themselves like Royalty...

Greed is no longer acceptable in San Diego, America's Finest City!

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SurfPuppy619 Aug. 26, 2010 @ 9:24 p.m.

Founder, you are going to be JW's next target if you keep rocking his boat!

But the truth is these pensions are off the hook. You have MULTI million dollar gov pensions being paid to gov officials that have no where near the experience or responsibilty of the private sector.

That yahoo for BP, forgot his name, he has a $15 million pension, but that is for a Fotune 50 company with billions in P&L bottom line responsibilty/liability. Then you have a CA Fire Chief (Craig Bowen-San Ramon FD) with a $10 million pension for running a 100 member fire department-I mean seriously, that is just crazy!!!!

You add up some of the gov pensions on the San Diego list and I am sure there are a few that will exceed $5, maybe even $7 or $8 million-that would exceed many CEO's in Fortune 500 companies.

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Don Bauder Aug. 26, 2010 @ 9:38 p.m.

Response to post #3: Some Wall Street economist predicted government defaults yesterday. I meant to try to find it online but got busy with other stuff. Yes, they are possible. Best, Don Bauder

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Don Bauder Aug. 26, 2010 @ 9:43 p.m.

Response to post #4: If it's decided that the vested pensions are sacrosanct, and can't even be broken by a bankruptcy judge, then I think there will have to be salary reductions for current workers in the 25-35% range. It sounds draconian, but it may be the only possible course. Best, Don Bauder

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Don Bauder Aug. 26, 2010 @ 10:19 p.m.

Response to post #5: We are posting the list. If you assign a certain lifetime to a retiree, you can approximate how much they will amass, although some details may be missing. Best, Don Bauder

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SurfPuppy619 Aug. 26, 2010 @ 11:33 p.m.

Some Wall Street economist predicted government defaults yesterday. I meant to try to find it online but got busy with other stuff. Yes, they are possible. Best, Don Bauder

==================

Aug. 25 (Bloomberg) -- Investors face defaults on government bonds given the burden of aging populations and the difficulty of increasing tax revenue, according to a Morgan Stanley executive director.

“Governments will impose a loss on some of their stakeholders,” Arnaud Mares in the firm’s London office wrote in a research report today. “The question is not whether they will renege on their promises, but rather upon which of their promises they will renege, and what form this default will take.” The sovereign-debt crisis is global “and it is not over,” he wrote.

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Founder Aug. 27, 2010 @ 7:35 a.m.

Reply #9, Great job with that post, + can we get one for current HUGE earners?

What is so amazing about that list BESIDE THE HUGE MONTHLY Pensions is that most, if not all, of the top Pensioners names are completely unknown to me!

I mean, for example, I've never heard of Mr. Gordon, but I must admit, I bet he is not having any problems paying his bills at the end of the month, since he is receiving almost $15,600 every month!

WOW

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Don Bauder Aug. 27, 2010 @ 7:36 a.m.

Response to post #10: Yes, that is the one. I will have to get the full report. Incidentally, as you can see, you can get the full list of City of San Diego retirees along with their monthly payment on this site. See post No. 9 or update at top of entry. Best, Don Bauder

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Founder Aug. 27, 2010 @ 7:51 a.m.

Reply to #10

RE: "The sovereign-debt crisis is global “and it is not over” Over, I don't think anyone is even talking about it YET...

I can see the headlines now: Bond Bubble Bursts

Anyone else feel that rumble?

I'm thinking it's a Governmental Bond Financial Avalanche...

If I owned Bonds, which I don't, I would sell them ASAP. As they become worth "less than the paper they are written on" we will see inflation begin to rise , although they will not call it that (at first...).

I wonder if anyone is tracking those that are now selling "short" in the Bond market or if that is even possible, I can't remember right now?

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Don Bauder Aug. 27, 2010 @ 9:38 a.m.

Response to post # 13: Yes, you can short fixed instruments. But if deflation takes hold, then what? Best, Don Bauder

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Founder Aug. 27, 2010 @ 4:10 p.m.

Reply #13 I was just considering using the number or amount of "shorts" as an indicator of Bond stability.

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Don Bauder Aug. 27, 2010 @ 4:55 p.m.

Response to post #15: The best thing to do is to watch interest rates, since bond prices go up when rates go down and vice versa. But predicting interest rates is almost impossible; there are so many variables involved. You might watch the performance of open-end bond bear funds or fixed-income reverse ETFs that bet on the decline of bond prices. Best, Don Bauder

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Don Bauder Aug. 27, 2010 @ 4:59 p.m.

Response to post #16: Yes, Gordon was in the city attorney's office for a long period. Best, Don Bauder

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SurfPuppy619 Aug. 27, 2010 @ 7:14 p.m.

Gene Gordon worked in the City Attorney's office. I believe he headed the litigation section in his last position before retiring. At least he actually worked for the city for 39 yrs and was actually of retirement age and no a 20yr perdon who "retired" at 44 or some such nonsense.

By crystalcove

I thought 3%@50 was the biggets scam, but I was wrong. When a 44 y/o City Attorney with only 20 years of actual service on the books can "retire" then we have most definitely jumped the shark...............this upside down ship cannot-I repeat,CANNOT- be righted with this system. It is impossible.

Frankly, it upsets me more than I thought it would, and I am sure the majority of the public feels similar.

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Founder Aug. 27, 2010 @ 8:13 p.m.

Reply #19 Again SP I'm with you!

I'm sure Mr. Gordon is a great guy and I wish I was his neighbor!

BUT

For anyone to have a Monthly pension of $15,500 from the City of San Diego, that is that big, is just mind boggling...

$15,500 x 12 months = $186,000 per Year!

$186,000 per Year is just too much to pay ANY City Employee, no matter who they are!

The City IBA Office should mandate a "CAP" on all salaries ASAP!

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Don Bauder Aug. 27, 2010 @ 9:43 p.m.

Response to post #19: It would make an interesting story to see how Gwinn worked such an early retirement. Best, Don Bauder

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Don Bauder Aug. 27, 2010 @ 9:46 p.m.

Response to post #20: If the City cannot legally get rid of the excessive pensions, it can slash salaries of current workers. Hopefully, San Diegans upon seeing these numbers will become aroused enough to do something. Best, Don Bauder

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JustWondering Aug. 27, 2010 @ 9:53 p.m.

Well then what you'll get, especially in the upper levels and professional position, is a revolving door, or a drain on corporate memory/knowledge.

This happened when Aguirre was elected. A huge amount of City/Municipal experience was out the door. And simply put, you don't hire folks who just passed the bar to run your litigation division.

I am always amazed by people who believe we're living in the 70's still when it comes to compensation. Top notch civil litigator bill between $200-500 an hour and are usually worth it.

In Mr. Gordon's case, I'd say without a doubt, he saved the city's ass many times. In fact I have no doubt his work saved taxpayers his yearly salary 20 of the nearly 40 years he served.

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Founder Aug. 28, 2010 @ 8:02 a.m.

Reply #20 We will soon see many questions asked and IMO, the sooner the better!

The City of SD costs well over $600,000 per day to operate right now...

We can't afford to put things off...

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SurfPuppy619 Aug. 28, 2010 @ 10:29 a.m.

Well then what you'll get, especially in the upper levels and professional position, is a revolving door, or a drain on corporate memory/knowledge.

Yes, everyone will quit, that "revolving door" as you call it, because America has TONS of better jobs all over the city, county and state!

Please JustCLueless, those cop union talking points may go over at an SEIU beach party, but not here. No one is going to be quiting, not even if they took a 50% pay cut, because no one is hiring.

And face the real facts, most gov employees would never cut it in the real world anyway, even if they could somehow get hired.......

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SurfPuppy619 Aug. 28, 2010 @ 10:33 a.m.

Ultimately, I believe, it will take a ruling from SCOTUS to decide whether or not pensions can be cut.

Gov pensions CAN be cut. The BK court in Prichard AL has cut county pensions. BK court is federal court-they can now cut pensions anywhere in America.

Will the SCOTUS eventually rule on it?? Possible, if they were to take up the issue-a big if. I think state courts could also cut pensions for FUTURE service years (not past already worked), all we need is a muni to make the challenge.

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Don Bauder Aug. 28, 2010 @ 3:54 p.m.

Response to post #23: That's not what I have heard, but but if you have it on good authority, go ahead and believe it. Best, Don Bauder

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Don Bauder Aug. 28, 2010 @ 3:56 p.m.

Response to post #24: I think everybody believes the case -- whoever brings it -- will ultimately be decided by the Supreme Court. Best, Don Bauder

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Don Bauder Aug. 28, 2010 @ 3:58 p.m.

Response to post #25: But what does it take to get people irritated? Or enraged? It seems that a proposed tax increase isn't enough to rouse San Diegans out of their torpor. Best, Don Bauder

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Don Bauder Aug. 28, 2010 @ 4 p.m.

Response to post #26: Yes, the argument that FFs and police will leave for greener pastures is absurd. But it's still being used. And, apparently, believed. Best, Don Bauder

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Don Bauder Aug. 28, 2010 @ 4:03 p.m.

Response to post #27: But even bankrupt Vallejo hasn't challenged the pensions, unless there is something that has happened since the last time I looked, which was several months ago. Best, Don Bauder

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SurfPuppy619 Aug. 28, 2010 @ 5:33 p.m.

But even bankrupt Vallejo hasn't challenged the pensions, unless there is something that has happened since the last time I looked, which was several months ago.

Why didn't they??? They have idiots running that city council, that's why.

Going after the pensions would have not cost them a dime-they're already in BK court, so why not? Because even though they had a majority on the council agree to file BK, there was still a majority in the FF/PD pockets that were too chicken to go aftr the pensions.

These pople do NOT need $100K pensions at any age, much less age 50-60. They will be fine on a $50K pension.

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Don Bauder Aug. 28, 2010 @ 9:53 p.m.

Response to post #33: I have read stories about Vallejo not trying to break the pension commitments, but I have not seen a plausible reason for it. There is one, however: whoever casts the first stone by filing the first suit is going to have one helluva financial burden as this case goes all the way to the Supreme Court. Best, Don Bauder

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Don Bauder Aug. 30, 2010 @ 6:31 a.m.

Response to post #35: Contracts are sacrosanct in the U.S. -- until the entity can no longer pay and goes into bankruptcy. Then contracts can (must) be broken. You don't think that breaking these pension commitments would be moral. But the City of San Diego cannot afford to make those commitments without absolutely slaughtering services to citizens, who might have a different view of morality. Best, Don Bauder

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SurfPuppy619 Aug. 30, 2010 @ 6:50 a.m.

Or, maybe it's just not moral.

You're right, scamming $100K+ pensions at age 50 that they didn't work for or earn isn't moral. Trying to force the costs of those scams on the poor and the innocent is even less moral.

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Founder Aug. 30, 2010 @ 9:17 a.m.

Reply #35

Are you suggesting "Moral",

as in, all the Citizens of San Diego should now PRAY for help?

If "Divine" Leadership", is what you are suggesting we now need,

then the City Council better start meeting every Sunday

and start passing the plate...

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Don Bauder Aug. 30, 2010 @ 12:31 p.m.

Response to post #37: JW may regret using that word "moral." Best, Don Bauder

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Don Bauder Aug. 30, 2010 @ 12:34 p.m.

Response to post #38: San Diego taxpayers -- and taxpayers in many other jurisdictions -- need some divine intervention. Best, Don Bauder

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Founder Aug. 31, 2010 @ 9:34 a.m.

Reply #40

I'm sad to say, I guess it is time to modernize the famous quote by Walt Kelly, first used on Earth Day in 1970:

"We Have Met The Enemy and He Is Us"... http://www.igopogo.com/we_have_met.htm

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Don Bauder Aug. 31, 2010 @ 10:08 a.m.

Response to posts #s 41 and 42: It's too bad Pogo never got elected president. Such wisdom. Best, Don Bauder

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